[vtkusers] World Units

[Matthew Troke]

What units are world dimensions in VTK? For example, if I create a cube
that is 1.0 in width, is that considered to be 1 meter, 1 cm, etc? Or are
they unitless and defined by the source data? I assume if you are loading
in some type of medical data, units are important.

Matt
--
Matthew Troke
Software Engineer
Office: 1-709-701-0239
Email: ***@avalonholographics.com

[David E DeMarle]

vtk itself is unitless. it is up to the application to keep track of that.

David E DeMarle
Kitware, Inc.
Principal Engineer
21 Corporate Drive
Clifton Park, NY 12065-8662
Phone: [phone]


On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 9:53 AM Matthew Troke <

Post by Matthew Troke
What units are world dimensions in VTK? For example, if I create a cube
that is 1.0 in width, is that considered to be 1 meter, 1 cm, etc? Or are
they unitless and defined by the source data? I assume if you are loading
in some type of medical data, units are important.
Matt
--
Matthew Troke
Software Engineer
Office: 1-709-701-0239
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[Ken Martin]

Although the OpenVR module does use the notion of a physical to world
transformation to map between meters in the VR room and the world
coordinates.

Post by David E DeMarle
vtk itself is unitless. it is up to the application to keep track of that.
David E DeMarle
Kitware, Inc.
Principal Engineer
21 Corporate Drive
Clifton Park, NY 12065-8662
Phone: [phone]
On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 9:53 AM Matthew Troke <

Post by Matthew Troke
What units are world dimensions in VTK? For example, if I create a cube
that is 1.0 in width, is that considered to be 1 meter, 1 cm, etc? Or are
they unitless and defined by the source data? I assume if you are loading
in some type of medical data, units are important.
Matt
--
Matthew Troke
Software Engineer
Office: 1-709-701-0239
*This email and any attachments are confidential and may be privileged.
Any unauthorized use, disclosure, copying or distribution of the
information received is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient
please contact the sender immediately by return email confirming that you
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[Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers]

We’ve not been using OpenVR directly, but have been using it indirectly with medical data. We ended up using m as the real world units, and then scaling loaded medical data by a factor of 1000 to convert from the commonly used mm, to m. This has worked well, but there are the odd gotchas when doing this– watch out for things like volume rendering step size which you may also need to scale.

Gavin Wheeler

From: vtkusers <vtkusers-***@public.kitware.com> On Behalf Of Ken Martin
Sent: 19 November 2018 16:22
To: Dave Demarle <***@kitware.com>
Cc: ***@public.kitware.com
Subject: Re: [vtkusers] World Units

Although the OpenVR module does use the notion of a physical to world transformation to map between meters in the VR room and the world coordinates.


On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 9:57 AM David E DeMarle <***@kitware.com<mailto:***@kitware.com>> wrote:
vtk itself is unitless. it is up to the application to keep track of that.

David E DeMarle
Kitware, Inc.
Principal Engineer
21 Corporate Drive
Clifton Park, NY 12065-8662
Phone: [phone]


On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 9:53 AM Matthew Troke <***@avalonholographics.com<mailto:***@avalonholographics.com>> wrote:
What units are world dimensions in VTK? For example, if I create a cube that is 1.0 in width, is that considered to be 1 meter, 1 cm, etc? Or are they unitless and defined by the source data? I assume if you are loading in some type of medical data, units are important.

Matt
--
Matthew Troke
Software Engineer
[Loading Image...]
Office: 1-709-701-0239
Email: ***@avalonholographics.com<mailto:***@avalonholographics.com>

This email and any attachments are confidential and may be privileged. Any unauthorized use, disclosure, copying or distribution of the information received is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient please contact the sender immediately by return email confirming that you have and will delete all communications related to the email and any attachments sent to you in error.
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[David Gobbi]

Hi Gavin,

Using mm for medical image data (with the exception of microscopy) is the
most common choice. I certainly wouldn't recommend using anything else.
I've also noticed the need to tweak volume rendering depending on
resolution.

David


On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 8:00 AM Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers <

Post by Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers
We’ve not been using OpenVR directly, but have been using it indirectly
with medical data. We ended up using m as the real world units, and then
scaling loaded medical data by a factor of 1000 to convert from the
commonly used mm, to m. This has worked well, but there are the odd gotchas
when doing this– watch out for things like volume rendering step size which
you may also need to scale.
Gavin Wheeler
Martin
*Sent:* 19 November 2018 16:22
*Subject:* Re: [vtkusers] World Units
Although the OpenVR module does use the notion of a physical to world
transformation to map between meters in the VR room and the world
coordinates.
vtk itself is unitless. it is up to the application to keep track of that.
David E DeMarle
Kitware, Inc.
Principal Engineer
21 Corporate Drive
Clifton Park, NY 12065-8662
Phone: [phone]

[Jean-Christophe Fillion-Robin]

Hi Gavin,

If you are working with medical data, you could look at 3D slicer (
https://slicer.org), it leverages VTK and ITK and also has the notion of
units built-in.

Hth
Jc

Post by David Gobbi
Hi Gavin,
Using mm for medical image data (with the exception of microscopy) is the
most common choice. I certainly wouldn't recommend using anything else.
I've also noticed the need to tweak volume rendering depending on
resolution.
David
On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 8:00 AM Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers <

Post by Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers
We’ve not been using OpenVR directly, but have been using it indirectly
with medical data. We ended up using m as the real world units, and then
scaling loaded medical data by a factor of 1000 to convert from the
commonly used mm, to m. This has worked well, but there are the odd gotchas
when doing this– watch out for things like volume rendering step size which
you may also need to scale.
Gavin Wheeler
Martin
*Sent:* 19 November 2018 16:22
*Subject:* Re: [vtkusers] World Units
Although the OpenVR module does use the notion of a physical to world
transformation to map between meters in the VR room and the world
coordinates.
vtk itself is unitless. it is up to the application to keep track of that.
David E DeMarle
Kitware, Inc.
Principal Engineer
21 Corporate Drive
Clifton Park, NY 12065-8662
Phone: [phone]
_______________________________________________

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[Matthew Troke]

Could you elaborate a little more on support for units in Slicer? What do
you mean by "built-in"?

Matt

On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 10:41 PM Jean-Christophe Fillion-Robin <

Post by David Gobbi
Hi Gavin,
If you are working with medical data, you could look at 3D slicer (
https://slicer.org), it leverages VTK and ITK and also has the notion of
units built-in.
Hth
Jc

Post by David Gobbi
Hi Gavin,
Using mm for medical image data (with the exception of microscopy) is the
most common choice. I certainly wouldn't recommend using anything else.
I've also noticed the need to tweak volume rendering depending on
resolution.
David
On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 8:00 AM Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers <

Post by Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers
We’ve not been using OpenVR directly, but have been using it indirectly
with medical data. We ended up using m as the real world units, and then
scaling loaded medical data by a factor of 1000 to convert from the
commonly used mm, to m. This has worked well, but there are the odd gotchas
when doing this– watch out for things like volume rendering step size which
you may also need to scale.
Gavin Wheeler
Martin
*Sent:* 19 November 2018 16:22
*Subject:* Re: [vtkusers] World Units
Although the OpenVR module does use the notion of a physical to world
transformation to map between meters in the VR room and the world
coordinates.
On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 9:57 AM David E DeMarle <
vtk itself is unitless. it is up to the application to keep track of that.
David E DeMarle
Kitware, Inc.
Principal Engineer
21 Corporate Drive
Clifton Park, NY 12065-8662
Phone: [phone]
_______________________________________________

Powered by www.kitware.com
Visit other Kitware open-source projects at
http://www.kitware.com/opensource/opensource.html
http://www.vtk.org/Wiki/VTK_FAQ
Search the list archives at: http://markmail.org/search/?q=vtkusers
https://public.kitware.com/mailman/listinfo/vtkusers

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--
Matthew Troke
Software Engineer
Office: 1-709-701-0239
Email: ***@avalonholographics.com

[Jean-Christophe Fillion-Robin]

Hi Matt,

Units are intended to be used to describe the quantity of a given object.
Units should help the application to be smarter about how the user can
access/view/interact with the data. For example, units help the user by
displaying the current unit in spinboxes as a suffix (1.3mm instead of
1.3).

For more details, see here
<https://www.slicer.org/wiki/Documentation/Nightly/Developers/Units>

Jc

On Wed, Nov 21, 2018 at 9:28 AM Matthew Troke <

Post by Matthew Troke
Could you elaborate a little more on support for units in Slicer? What do
you mean by "built-in"?
Matt
On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 10:41 PM Jean-Christophe Fillion-Robin <

Post by David Gobbi
Hi Gavin,
If you are working with medical data, you could look at 3D slicer (
https://slicer.org), it leverages VTK and ITK and also has the notion of
units built-in.
Hth
Jc

Post by David Gobbi
Hi Gavin,
Using mm for medical image data (with the exception of microscopy) is
the most common choice. I certainly wouldn't recommend using anything
else. I've also noticed the need to tweak volume rendering depending on
resolution.
David
On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 8:00 AM Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers <

Post by Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers
We’ve not been using OpenVR directly, but have been using it indirectly
with medical data. We ended up using m as the real world units, and then
scaling loaded medical data by a factor of 1000 to convert from the
commonly used mm, to m. This has worked well, but there are the odd gotchas
when doing this– watch out for things like volume rendering step size which
you may also need to scale.
Gavin Wheeler
Martin
*Sent:* 19 November 2018 16:22
*Subject:* Re: [vtkusers] World Units
Although the OpenVR module does use the notion of a physical to world
transformation to map between meters in the VR room and the world
coordinates.
On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 9:57 AM David E DeMarle <
vtk itself is unitless. it is up to the application to keep track of that.
David E DeMarle
Kitware, Inc.
Principal Engineer
21 Corporate Drive
Clifton Park, NY 12065-8662
Phone: [phone]
_______________________________________________

Powered by www.kitware.com
Visit other Kitware open-source projects at
http://www.kitware.com/opensource/opensource.html
http://www.vtk.org/Wiki/VTK_FAQ
Search the list archives at: http://markmail.org/search/?q=vtkusers
https://public.kitware.com/mailman/listinfo/vtkusers

_______________________________________________
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Visit other Kitware open-source projects at
http://www.kitware.com/opensource/opensource.html
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Search the list archives at: http://markmail.org/search/?q=vtkusers
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--
Matthew Troke
Software Engineer
Office: 1-709-701-0239
*This email and any attachments are confidential and may be privileged.
Any unauthorized use, disclosure, copying or distribution of the
information received is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient
please contact the sender immediately by return email confirming that you
have and will delete all communications related to the email and any
attachments sent to you in error.*

[Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers]

Hi,

3D Slicer does indeed have a lot of functionality, and we use it within our department. However, the project I am working on is primarily concerned with Interaction and User Interface, so we are using VTK within Unity. By default Unity’s units are metres, and we stuck with that. However, since we made that decision we now know more about Unity, and their advice is to scale assets/worlds etc. as appropriate if metres isn’t appropriate. So effectively it’s unitless, but by default the unitless units are metres. If that makes sense. In the end metres works for us pretty well as we are developing room scale applications.

I think it is similar for VTK, for one application there may be a default unit, but for another application a different one. I imagine tracking these and ensuring they all work would be a bit of a nightmare/ basically impossible to ensure. So it and responsibility are left up to the user. My solution to this isn’t elegant – for variables with a unit I suffix them ‘m’ or ‘mm’ or ‘s’ etc.

Best regards,

Gavin


From: vtkusers <vtkusers-***@public.kitware.com> On Behalf Of Jean-Christophe Fillion-Robin
Sent: 21 November 2018 16:42
To: ***@avalonholographics.com
Cc: David Gobbi <***@gmail.com>; Steve Pieper <***@isomics.com>; ***@public.kitware.com
Subject: Re: [vtkusers] World Units

Hi Matt,

Units are intended to be used to describe the quantity of a given object. Units should help the application to be smarter about how the user can access/view/interact with the data. For example, units help the user by displaying the current unit in spinboxes as a suffix (1.3mm instead of 1.3).

For more details, see here<https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.slicer.org%2Fwiki%2FDocumentation%2FNightly%2FDevelopers%2FUnits&data=01%7C01%7Cgavin.wheeler%40kcl.ac.uk%7Cc4187c8b6527455345b708d64fd051f7%7C8370cf1416f34c16b83c724071654356%7C0&sdata=SZNXij8JTJ3ygHwkERKMDuI7cZIAfvY9Z3gMbDM0jlo%3D&reserved=0>

Jc

On Wed, Nov 21, 2018 at 9:28 AM Matthew Troke <***@avalonholographics.com<mailto:***@avalonholographics.com>> wrote:
Could you elaborate a little more on support for units in Slicer? What do you mean by "built-in"?

Matt

On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 10:41 PM Jean-Christophe Fillion-Robin <***@kitware.com<mailto:***@kitware.com>> wrote:
Hi Gavin,

If you are working with medical data, you could look at 3D slicer (https://slicer.org<https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fslicer.org&data=01%7C01%7Cgavin.wheeler%40kcl.ac.uk%7Cc4187c8b6527455345b708d64fd051f7%7C8370cf1416f34c16b83c724071654356%7C0&sdata=Fyl%2Bs0UrSdZr5XCP3SUK4yTawu77%2FFIb7qPC7z1lM80%3D&reserved=0>), it leverages VTK and ITK and also has the notion of units built-in.

Hth
Jc

On Tue, Nov 20, 2018, 9:13 AM David Gobbi <***@gmail.com<mailto:***@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Gavin,

Using mm for medical image data (with the exception of microscopy) is the most common choice. I certainly wouldn't recommend using anything else. I've also noticed the need to tweak volume rendering depending on resolution.

David

On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 8:00 AM Wheeler, Gavin via vtkusers <***@public.kitware.com<mailto:***@public.kitware.com>> wrote:
We’ve not been using OpenVR directly, but have been using it indirectly with medical data. We ended up using m as the real world units, and then scaling loaded medical data by a factor of 1000 to convert from the commonly used mm, to m. This has worked well, but there are the odd gotchas when doing this– watch out for things like volume rendering step size which you may also need to scale.

Gavin Wheeler

From: vtkusers <vtkusers-***@public.kitware.com<mailto:vtkusers-***@public.kitware.com>> On Behalf Of Ken Martin
Sent: 19 November 2018 16:22
To: Dave Demarle <***@kitware.com<mailto:***@kitware.com>>
Cc: ***@public.kitware.com<mailto:***@public.kitware.com>
Subject: Re: [vtkusers] World Units

Although the OpenVR module does use the notion of a physical to world transformation to map between meters in the VR room and the world coordinates.


On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 9:57 AM David E DeMarle <***@kitware.com<mailto:***@kitware.com>> wrote:
vtk itself is unitless. it is up to the application to keep track of that.

David E DeMarle
Kitware, Inc.
Principal Engineer
21 Corporate Drive
Clifton Park, NY 12065-8662
Phone: [phone]
_______________________________________________
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